The 69 Questions Sam & Eddie Must Answer

With all of the taxpayer money being spent to gain approval of Greenlink, I thought you might be interested to know what some readers of the Windsor Star have to say about Greenlink from the opposite side.

Here is why I decided to post the comments. Obviously we've heard about the huge percentages in favor of the Schwartz Git-R-Done solution. Except the reality is that only a small number of Windsorites have given their approval as I pointed out this morning. When I went to the Star Forum website, I expected to see almost everything being favorable to Greenlink. Imagine my surprise when I saw all of these negative comments.

Where are these comments being reflected, certainly not by the Mayor or even by the Star itself?

Accordingly, I decided to give them an outlet. I've no idea how many hits the Star's website gets. When Don McArthur said that he had "seven" readers, I knew he was kidding but my suspicion is that the total numbers are significantly less than the Star's circulation.

This is from "Sound Off! Will Schwartz's plan make Windsor the envy of other North American cities?"

1. The Sam Schwartz tunnel doesn't look like a tunnel at all. It looks more like the below grade proposal with a bit of dirt on top. Besides that the Sam Schwartz tunnel will be in sections not one complete tunnel which is similar to the below grade proposal which also has some tunneling parts.


2. Looking at the Sam Schwartz tunnel it would still have a major disruption on the business section.


3. Schwartz proposal would send all the provincial engineers back to the drawing board for another five years.


4. So the guy who wanted to pave Ojibway Park in 2005 has morphed into Mr. GreenLink in 2007


5. $500,000 for proposing slighty longer and narrower tunnels than the DRIC plan!


6. First of all its too expensive, second, why does Windsor have to have a "tunnel freeway".


7. As for the pollution the trucks generate, the root of the problem comes from the trucks backed up because American customs are slow to process them


8. what if there is a major accident, and/or involving dangerous chemicals and flammables or even a terrorist attack


9. what if the tunnel sustains major damage, think of the traffic mess that would generate.


10. The DRIC team was called on the carpet and criticized for not proposing a vented tunnel with scrubbers that would magically clean and purify the air. They told us that this technology didn't exist, but we beat them up anyhow. So, Sam, Eddie, where are the scrubbers and air cleaners in your proposal


11. Why does the tunneled route from the 401 not split, one way toward the new bridge, and the other to the Ambassador Bridge? Trucks will continue to take the Ambassador Bridge because of the likely cheaper (and competitive) tolls, which will mean they will still be on our city streets without a tunneled route.


12. when are people gonna realize that if a road goes underground or not underfround it has the same environmental impact, jut hiding things underground doesnt make anything disapear.


13. would you ever want to relocate your children near a park that is built on top of a highway


14. it still wont lure Windsor's image. It might create a few people who want to drive through it once


15. it will be an eyesore after a few months.


16. There is no perfect plan except to open all the booths that run at 50% at the bridge.


17. There seems to be a new plan every few months by the various governements


18. This plan is designed for a wow factor - yes - great. But how realistic is it?


19. No scrubbers, except that the City has criticised the DRIC for not having scrubbers.


20. Narrower lanes. If 4 lanes are all that are needed, why is the city of Windsor stating Huron Church Road - 6-lanes - are not adequate for the Ambassador Bridge.


21. No solution for the existing border crossing presented.


22. Who will pay for the maintenance of the green spaces, tennis courts etc. and/or construction? The FEDS have committed to 50% of the cost of the ROAD. The city can barely afford to maintain their parks as it is, let alone MORE parkspace.


23. If trees can "scrub" the emissions, what is the point of such long tunneled sections? Clearly, air quality is not the huge concern it has been made out to be.


24. What about Sandwich area? Are they not worthy what South Windsor is getting? Sandwich will now be "sandwiched" between TWO border highways and TWO bridges.


25. This plan sounds better but the concerns that remain are the traffic volume, air quality and how the city will maintain all the open green areas.


26. This problem goes way beyond dressing up Huron Church Rd.


27. It makes me wonder why the city is so intent on getting trucks off Huron Road when they don't seem to mind the trucks using the Tunnel and going thru the middle of down town.


28. Make a link to the existing bridge - otherwise you will have trucks taking local steets to take advantage of low toll rates at the existing bridge


29. Let the bridge company build a new bridge and they will absorb all the cost.


30. Where are the details of this plan?!? The guys Sam/Eddie have trotted in here are the guys [involved in]the Big Dig - a project that went $10 billion over budget!


31. The Windsor plan and the DRIC plan are, except for a few points, the same thing. Who's kidding who? Everybody managed to waste a lot of money that we, as taxpayers can't afford


32. It was still a mistake not to include Ambassador with a split at E.C. Row as others suggested. It could be tunneled up to Ambassador too for more cost, but DRIC is ignoring Ambassador too


33. Tunnels to nowhere. Both the dric and this new greenway do not address the fact they are leading to a bridge that is not built. Where will Michigan want a bridge to come out? Michigan is nearly broke and will not help fund a new bridge and they dont care about our problems


34. We have barely enough money to maintain our existing parks. Where is the money going to come from to maintain these new parks? How many more parks and natural areas do we need on the west side?


35. widen and upgrade EC Row Expressway and extend Lauzon Parkway out to the 401 and beyond to Highway 3.


36. What magical solution is there to ensure that only local traffic uses the Ambassador bridge


37. The city's proposal is lacking details - substantial ones that bring to question the over cost-advantages


38. Where is traffic routed during the construction of these tunnels?


39. Why are there no maintenance tunnels shown in the "short tunnels?"


40. Where is the emergency access/egress from these tunnels and what is the minimum distance required between emergency entrances?


41. What fireproofing designs are anticipated?


42. Where are the pumping stations to pump out water from the tunnels?


43. Where do these pumping stations empty into?...


44. What about relocations of all the underground utilities along Huron Church Road such as hydro, gas, water mains, and sewer lines?


45. How does the plan propose dealing with the high water table in the area and potential leaks?


46. How does the plan deal with the substandard soil conditions in the area?...


47. What state of the art rail tunnel is Sam Schwartz talking about for the relief of traffic post-2035?


48. How will tunnels be expanded should traffic volumes increase beyond what is expected?


49. Who will pay for the maintenance of parkland and tree replacement - studies indicate that pollution kills trees - notably particulate matter and nitrous oxide.


50. Maybe if Tecumseh just starts building a tunnel maybe we might decide on which one we want, worked for a arena!


51. The DRIC proposes something that they know no one will accept and then Windsor pays an additional half milllion to basically expand on the DRIC idea.


52. So much for not accepting anything less than a fully tunelled route.


53. Are Jet Fans a fancy word for scrubbers or will they simply push the polluted air out of the covered portions back onto the neighborhoods?


54. score one for south windsor but nothing for the far west end.


55. There are so many unexpected and hidden expenses to come, it's common sense to anyone with half a brain. This candy coated "paradise proposal" is the "Shock and Awe" campaign for Windsor. I'm glad to see the residents aeren't falling for it.


56. I guess our taxes can forever skyrocket, and the city can hire a whole new slew of people to maintain our hippy gardens


57. To be honest I thought , WOW, finally a plan excelling all others by promoting large attractive green spaces , plus useable for all ages and environmentally correct. A real bonus. Then I start reading the comments . So many cons that my elation got deflated.


58. Too much money has been spent and nothing ever get's accomplished.


59. All back to square one when you think too much


60. the delays are not related to border crossing capacity. Border delays occur because the current system for clearing shipments into the USA combined with the USA's demand for tight border security is why the border backs up.


61. The Ambassador Bridge should be replaced with a new span because the current span is nearing the end of its designed service life. The owner is willing to do it on his dime. Let him.


62. We already have a corridor through the west side, Huron Road. Use the $1.5 billion dollars to improve that corridor. Capacity is not a factor, traffic volumes will not increase considerably into the future. Do not be fooled by economists and politicians that preach unending economic growth.


63. A new border crossing will not spur investment in this region. A border crossing that bypasses the city will expedite shipments to eastern Ontario and the new auto capital of Canada, Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge


64. The State of Michigan is threatening to stop funding MDOT contributions to DRIC because Lansing has recognized DRIC for what it has become a tax dollar sink hole.


65. Another crossing only means that US Customs will have fewer agents at each crossing.


66. The money can be spent to impove the quality of an existing corridor to the benefit of those that drive it, do business along it and live near it.


67. you want your kids playing in a park with jet fans blowing fumes and brake dust on them. Not me!


68. Pick one people. DRIC or the city plan and make it quick, 'cause there is a third option... Hwy 402 from London to Sarnia which means totally bypassing Windsor. If we can't come up with a solid decision on one or the other and if we put up enough flak in the air about both proposals, the Feds and the province are simply going to wash their hands, turn their back on us and pump all the money into the 402 Sarnia corridor.


69. The simple fact is there will be the same fumes bellowing out of the openings of all these tunnels as there is now, they think by adding 5 billion plants that they will filter the air enough to couter act the polution, that is perpoustous.

Whew, not a bad list of issues prepared by non-engineering types. Imagine what professional engineers would ask of Sam and Parsons Brinckerhoff. Perhaps we should give this to Sam to answer but then again I wouldn't want to have to spend another half million of taxpayer dollars to do so.

My point in setting out all of this information is just to let you know not to believe everything you hear from City Hall about the support of Windsorites for Greenlink. With flaws like this, can anyone take the Mayor's solution seriously or should we just view it as another stall tactic.

Can some of Sam's work be used, sure. Can some of DRIC's work be used, sure. Can some of the Ambassador Bridge's work be used, sure again.

We won't have a solution however in Windsor when Sam's work is used to "counter" that of DRIC and when the Ambassador Bridge is viewed as the enemy. We won't have a solution in Windsor when Governments believe that they can force the Ambassador Bridge out of business instead of recognizing that this Company has made this border crossing the most important in North America and the key border crossing for Canada's economy. We won't have a solution in Windsor when the parties involved refuse to sit down and talk to each other.

Is there a border solution? Of course there is and it was reachable years ago. It is the one that has been proposed all the way along except we mere taxpayers have not been a let in on it. It's just like in Sarnia where all the studies in the world wound up with a bridge not upriver or downriver but right at the existing crossing. And Governments built expressways to serve those two bridges.

That has always been the solution and we are just going through an exercise designed to force the sale of a "private" business.